Comments on: The president’s bodyguards and the torch http://www.blackandwhitecat.org/2008/05/08/the-presidents-bodyguards-and-the-torch/ China and Other things Sat, 05 Jul 2008 00:24:47 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.2.3 By: Ed http://www.blackandwhitecat.org/2008/05/08/the-presidents-bodyguards-and-the-torch/#comment-8882 Ed Sun, 11 May 2008 20:52:26 +0000 http://www.blackandwhitecat.org/2008/05/08/the-presidents-bodyguards-and-the-torch/#comment-8882 WL, surely people can see the difference between 'one world, one dream' and 'one folk, one empire, one leader'? In fact, the only similarity is the word 'one'. WL, surely people can see the difference between ‘one world, one dream’ and ‘one folk, one empire, one leader’?

In fact, the only similarity is the word ‘one’.

]]> By: Nimrod http://www.blackandwhitecat.org/2008/05/08/the-presidents-bodyguards-and-the-torch/#comment-8881 Nimrod Sun, 11 May 2008 19:33:37 +0000 http://www.blackandwhitecat.org/2008/05/08/the-presidents-bodyguards-and-the-torch/#comment-8881 Jay, has it occurred to you that people in some country also doesn't like it when they see foreign protestors assaulting their fellow disabled citizens, especially over a stupid flame? Maybe that's why those flame guards were there in the first place. Jay, has it occurred to you that people in some country also doesn’t like it when they see foreign protestors assaulting their fellow disabled citizens, especially over a stupid flame? Maybe that’s why those flame guards were there in the first place.

]]> By: Nimrod http://www.blackandwhitecat.org/2008/05/08/the-presidents-bodyguards-and-the-torch/#comment-8880 Nimrod Sun, 11 May 2008 19:30:58 +0000 http://www.blackandwhitecat.org/2008/05/08/the-presidents-bodyguards-and-the-torch/#comment-8880 Yeah, why don't the Buddhists give up the dharma symbol just because Hitler used the reverse of it as the swastika once. Tsk tsk, quite unfortunate choice, those Buddhists. Yeah, why don’t the Buddhists give up the dharma symbol just because Hitler used the reverse of it as the swastika once. Tsk tsk, quite unfortunate choice, those Buddhists.

]]> By: WL http://www.blackandwhitecat.org/2008/05/08/the-presidents-bodyguards-and-the-torch/#comment-8879 WL Sun, 11 May 2008 15:11:09 +0000 http://www.blackandwhitecat.org/2008/05/08/the-presidents-bodyguards-and-the-torch/#comment-8879 1936 Ein Volk, ein Reich, ein Fuehrer 2008 One world, one dream quite unfortunate choice 1936 Ein Volk, ein Reich, ein Fuehrer

2008 One world, one dream

quite unfortunate choice

]]> By: jay http://www.blackandwhitecat.org/2008/05/08/the-presidents-bodyguards-and-the-torch/#comment-8877 jay Sun, 11 May 2008 08:18:15 +0000 http://www.blackandwhitecat.org/2008/05/08/the-presidents-bodyguards-and-the-torch/#comment-8877 I think it boils down to people in one country not liking it when they see police from a foreign land whacking their fellow citizens in their own country. Especially not over a stupid flame. I think it boils down to people in one country not liking it when they see police from a foreign land whacking their fellow citizens in their own country. Especially not over a stupid flame.

]]> By: Ed http://www.blackandwhitecat.org/2008/05/08/the-presidents-bodyguards-and-the-torch/#comment-8873 Ed Sat, 10 May 2008 21:06:13 +0000 http://www.blackandwhitecat.org/2008/05/08/the-presidents-bodyguards-and-the-torch/#comment-8873 Objectively, the Greeks look pretty menacing to me, especially the guy on the right. I'm guessing the oblong bulge below his stomach is not there for sports purposes. This is all about politics and perceptions. If you had told anyone the Greek picture was of Rhodesion or Serbian state security officers, all kinds of mental images would ensue. It's got nothing to do with observed facts. And Richard, Coe is a Tory. Anyone who so much as breathes across him, let alone a commie, is a thug to him. Objectively, the Greeks look pretty menacing to me, especially the guy on the right. I’m guessing the oblong bulge below his stomach is not there for sports purposes.

This is all about politics and perceptions. If you had told anyone the Greek picture was of Rhodesion or Serbian state security officers, all kinds of mental images would ensue. It’s got nothing to do with observed facts.

And Richard, Coe is a Tory. Anyone who so much as breathes across him, let alone a commie, is a thug to him.

]]> By: Nimrod http://www.blackandwhitecat.org/2008/05/08/the-presidents-bodyguards-and-the-torch/#comment-8870 Nimrod Sat, 10 May 2008 06:57:26 +0000 http://www.blackandwhitecat.org/2008/05/08/the-presidents-bodyguards-and-the-torch/#comment-8870 Richard, I get it, but it is still frustrating. China borrows many things from the West. A unified nation state is from the West, Communism is from the West, the ideal of internationalism, i.e. "one world", is certainly from the West, the Olympics is from the West. Nothing on display that I can see is particularly Chinese. The Western prejudice really comes down to the notion that Chinese are counterfeiting Western culture and doing it in a bad way, and therefore they must show their disapproval. Chinese people have this prejudice, too, e.g. often believing Westerners can't learn Chinese well enough. Richard, I get it, but it is still frustrating. China borrows many things from the West. A unified nation state is from the West, Communism is from the West, the ideal of internationalism, i.e. “one world”, is certainly from the West, the Olympics is from the West. Nothing on display that I can see is particularly Chinese. The Western prejudice really comes down to the notion that Chinese are counterfeiting Western culture and doing it in a bad way, and therefore they must show their disapproval. Chinese people have this prejudice, too, e.g. often believing Westerners can’t learn Chinese well enough.

]]> By: Richard http://www.blackandwhitecat.org/2008/05/08/the-presidents-bodyguards-and-the-torch/#comment-8869 Richard Sat, 10 May 2008 05:32:40 +0000 http://www.blackandwhitecat.org/2008/05/08/the-presidents-bodyguards-and-the-torch/#comment-8869 bchung/nimrod - this seemed to be a pr issue so I was talking about it from a pr perspective. the appearance (and background) of the PAP guys played into the image the west has of how a police state behaves (any police state - not just a Chinese one), coupled with the fear that Asian dictatorships (Mao's China, North Korea) attempt to impose a certain type of uniformity. One of the nice things about China is its diversity: one of the saddest things about the Olympics is that the government has in its risk-averse way decided to demonstrate cultural strength through order and uniformity (One World One Dream; One Chinese people, united; nothing and noone must be out of place). Unfortunately this does play to the worst western prejudices, many of which I agree are unpleasant. The whole idea of sending security guys round the world to guard a torch on foreign territory (or a bicycle race or whatever) seems to me to be an accident waiting to happen. With Greece and France nobody takes them seriously enough as world powers for it to matter perhaps - it was always going to be China that got stuffed on that. On the other hand, it's hard to imagine what would happen if a bunch of British police barged the president of the Beijing Olympic Committee out of the way on the streets of Beijing. I imagine an apology would be pretty swiftly forthcoming, at the very least. Or tried to tell a Chinese woman carrying the torch how to do it. As I say (which you do not take into account) it was the head of the UK Olympic committee who called them thugs, on the basis of the way they treated him, not me. I wasn't there. There was a lot of thuggish behaviour too by the protesters which is, er, why they were arrested... (and by the way, based on my knowledge of the Greeks, I rather suspect they would "just smile and say “thats not very nice trying to snatch the torch”. There. Now I've insulted two nations in one go. bchung/nimrod - this seemed to be a pr issue so I was talking about it from a pr perspective. the appearance (and background) of the PAP guys played into the image the west has of how a police state behaves (any police state - not just a Chinese one), coupled with the fear that Asian dictatorships (Mao’s China, North Korea) attempt to impose a certain type of uniformity. One of the nice things about China is its diversity: one of the saddest things about the Olympics is that the government has in its risk-averse way decided to demonstrate cultural strength through order and uniformity (One World One Dream; One Chinese people, united; nothing and noone must be out of place). Unfortunately this does play to the worst western prejudices, many of which I agree are unpleasant.
The whole idea of sending security guys round the world to guard a torch on foreign territory (or a bicycle race or whatever) seems to me to be an accident waiting to happen. With Greece and France nobody takes them seriously enough as world powers for it to matter perhaps - it was always going to be China that got stuffed on that. On the other hand, it’s hard to imagine what would happen if a bunch of British police barged the president of the Beijing Olympic Committee out of the way on the streets of Beijing. I imagine an apology would be pretty swiftly forthcoming, at the very least. Or tried to tell a Chinese woman carrying the torch how to do it.
As I say (which you do not take into account) it was the head of the UK Olympic committee who called them thugs, on the basis of the way they treated him, not me. I wasn’t there. There was a lot of thuggish behaviour too by the protesters which is, er, why they were arrested…
(and by the way, based on my knowledge of the Greeks, I rather suspect they would “just smile and say “thats not very nice trying to snatch the torch”. There. Now I’ve insulted two nations in one go.

]]> By: hotshotdebut http://www.blackandwhitecat.org/2008/05/08/the-presidents-bodyguards-and-the-torch/#comment-8865 hotshotdebut Sat, 10 May 2008 00:57:30 +0000 http://www.blackandwhitecat.org/2008/05/08/the-presidents-bodyguards-and-the-torch/#comment-8865 They look definitely not mainlanders to me. By the way, that guy is very cute. They look definitely not mainlanders to me.
By the way, that guy is very cute.

]]> By: Nimrod http://www.blackandwhitecat.org/2008/05/08/the-presidents-bodyguards-and-the-torch/#comment-8847 Nimrod Fri, 09 May 2008 20:15:19 +0000 http://www.blackandwhitecat.org/2008/05/08/the-presidents-bodyguards-and-the-torch/#comment-8847 Poor Richard, the Chinese were organized-looking and had nicely fitting sports gear. Dear god... Poor Richard, the Chinese were organized-looking and had nicely fitting sports gear. Dear god…

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